Re: virus: Looking for blame in all the wrong places

Brett Robertson (
Sun, 2 May 1999 21:15:52 -0500 (EST)

Content-Type: Text/Plain; Charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: Quoted-Printable

The final acts of great men are foreshadowed by the position they profess. Death "scripts" are written by them throughout their life and by which they gain power, but also according to which their power influences others to play the parts which seal their fate to that foretold by the philosophy they stand for.

In a subjectivistic worldview, an us-against-them mentality is set up-- objective materialist against subjective humanist. This foretells that the end times of powerful subjectivists will be like an Armageddon (as all dualistic scripts necessitate... the singularity of self which would otherwise survive is not objectively represented by the dualistic system=A0in which process is primary and product is contingent and where each part of the system-- me or you-- is similarly a *contingency* with regards to the overall survival of the worldview).

So, as death is necessary for a dualistic philosopher, and as exile from the group is an option which suggests independence (and independence is materialistic-- or supports a philosophy of independent OBJECTIVE existence); so perhaps, the environment conspired to give Socrates the end he required to fulfill his own prophecy (choosing suicide rather than social exclusion for him since Socrates' own existence would be contingent on humanistic/ subjective confirmation according to his own life-story).

Brett Lane Robertson
Indiana, USA
MindRecreation Metaphysical Assn.
BIO: ...........
Put your item up for auction! Bid on hot opportunities! Click HERE to view great deals!:

Content-Disposition: Inline
Content-Type: Message/RFC822
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7Bit

Received: from ( by; Sun, 2 May 1999 16:43:27 -0700

Return-Path: <>
Received: from ( []) by (8.8.8/ms.graham.14Aug97)
	with ESMTP id QAA12739; Sun, 2 May 1999 16:43:27 -0700 (PDT)
Received: (from majordom@localhost) by (8.9.1/8.9.1) id
	RAA03073 for virus-outgoing; Sun, 2 May 1999 17:30:33 -0600
Message-ID: <>
Date: Sun, 2 May 1999 19:29:06 EDT
Subject: Re: virus: Looking for blame in all the wrong places To:
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
X-Mailer: AOL 4.0.i for Windows 95 sub 43 Sender:
Precedence: bulk

In a message dated 5/2/99 2:37:36 PM Pacific Daylight Time, writes:

> Socrates was offered the choice of exile or hemlock. He chose the poison.
> Which factor do you think is most to blame for the Socratic tragedy?
> Radical Greek philosophical notions promoted extremist beliefs.
> Violent arguments about the nature of society leads to more widespread
> violence
> His parents failed him by not taking responsibility for him.
> Experimental theatre promoted anti-social behavior.
> Poison was just to easy to find.
> No! No! No! A thousand times no! The reason we respect him today is that he
> committed suicide because it was the only ethical protest he could make in
> society that forbade other forms of protest.

>From what I have read, Socrates had recourse to public platform and
opportunity for moral suasion during his defense and as I recall it was weak, suggesting as you and other scholars imply suicide was a deliberate choice. Are you also implying it was a political act? If so, was he a pacifist? It seems that in exile he would have had opportunity to act politically more effectively. If it was a matter strictly of ethics, right and wrong, his act was a surrender. It seems ironic that his pupils were able to use his methods to their own ends ( revolt and power being an extremee form of protest ) yet Socrates himself failed.

I hope I have not infected anyone in this my first posting to this list.