Re: virus: Rationality in the Cave

Fri, 12 Mar 1999 22:24:05 -0800

maggs wrote:

> And what is faith? In organized religious sects, it is fear entwined
> with bribery of an afterlife if the rules are followed unless if not in a
> sect
> it is a tangible experience of an individual.

I had hoped to convey with the allegory that one label, "faith," gets applied to a wide variety of phenomena, experience, and behavior. Do you think the definition you provided in the quoted paragraph is an exhaustive description of all of the "faiths" presented in the Cave story?

> > Now, one of the prisoners who is situated close to her, and who was
> > never one of the CR superstars detects an unfamiliar scent on the
> > prisoner who claims to have been outside the cave, and what's more, her
> > story just seems to "ring true" to his ears, and the unfamiliar scent,
> > for him, adds credence to her story. This prisoner is now a believer.
> was it pg 24 of that alien book?

Which book is that?

> > The silverbacks roll their eyes dismisivley at the new believer. She has
> > infected the believer with her faith. The silverbacks call the
> > believer's acceptance of her story "faith," and they apply this same
> > lable to her belief that her experiences were something other than a
> > hallucination, but wouldn't you agree that his belief and hers are
> > rather different?

> She believes because of a first cause of reality that
> does not have a first cause.

Could you unpack that a bit? I'm not sure what I was supposed to take away from that sentence.

> They can be expressed in CR semantics with the same


> CR semantics: <--- ... ~ {A,B,C...1,2,3..} unless
> {A,B,C...1,2,3}
> {a,b,c...!@#%...} unless ~ {a,b,c...|+_)(*..} --->

I don't know how to read this.

> Either she uses equations written in mathematical symbolism or uses
> descriptive mathematical language forming her semantics.

Why do you say that she uses mathematical language? Is this necessarily the case? We seem to be on very different pages, and I need a bit of primer to bring me up to speed on your line of argument.

> (Ex)(Cx&Fx)>(\/x)Fx

I don't know what this says. It seems to be saying, "There exists an x such that if x is both C and F then..." and I'm stumped by every thing after the conditional. I don't know what C and F mean or what you hoped to convey with this sentence. If it is important to your point and you'd like to be understood, you may wish to say a bit more about this as well.

> > Others don't worry too much about the contradiction. They play the
> > shadow game and strive for the rewards it offers and pay lipservice to
> > the idea that there is an outside because doing so gives them a place in
> > the community of the "faithfull" and the support of that community.
> The greatest good, the ultimate happiness is to be unjust yet
> considered just.

Hey, Glaucon. Long time no see. What up?