Re: virus: Faith and Reason

David McFadzean (
Tue, 09 Mar 1999 10:20:29 -0700

At 11:59 AM 3/9/99 -0500, Reed Konsler wrote:

>>consistency checking. Are you sure faith creates models the same
>>way? I don't see how offhand.
>Faith checks to see if an arguement is consistent with the
>fundamentals. What does reason check against...the premises?
>What is the difference between a premise and a fundamental?

I don't know what you mean by "fundamental".

>>To decide if we want to continue playing.
>Who is "we"? You and I, this group, all humanity, the multiverse?
>My answer depends on that. It matters that "we" understand "us",
>to be sure.

The participants in this conversation.

>>Rule #6 (proposed): If a player does not agree to a rule, he or
>>she must withdraw from the game.
>Rule #6b (proposed): Each player interprets the rules for themselves.
>Thus, a player may choose to leave the game at any time, or remain
>in it, with complete freedom of expression.

Are you giving players the freedom to break the rules?

>>Rule #7 (proposed): The game ends if only one player remains.
>Disagree. Real games have no beginning and no end, no winners
>and losers, and no points-keepers. What you are thinkink of is
>an illusion, like chess. Computers are sufficient to play such
>"games". It's the real games, which require the human touch,
>which I'm interested in.

This game is this conversation. If you want to remain in the game when you are the only one talking, I guess that is your prerogative.

>>I'm not sure I want to play a game where fallacies are valid moves.
>[shrug] We each define our own fallacies. Dennett made up "the
>argument from incredulity" in _Darwin's Dangerous Idea_. He
>said it was a fallacy to say "X is false becuase I can't believe that
>X might be true". The failure is one of imagination, not reality.

If you want, we could rule out fallacies as invalid moves if and when they come up. I just wanted to let you know in advance that I'm unlikely to accept any of the standard logical fallacies.

David McFadzean       
Memetic Engineer      
Church of Virus