> ...no one can prove
> > that there is not some kind of god - greater power than
> > us - whatever you want to call it.
I have to disagree. There are numerous proofs that certain types of beings
greater than us don't exist:
http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/nontheism/atheism/arguments.html
(among the beings which can't exist: just about any being which has more
than 1 of the following traits: omniscient, omnipotent, omnibenevolent,
personal)
Of course, if you want to say that God is not bound by logical arguments,
then BY ALL MEANS -- but so much for any chance of being a virian saint!
I do, of course, admit that some kind of higher being could exist --
however, It certainly is very restricted in what It can be and do.
Just before we rule out all theists, however, I'd like to point out that
for much of history, belief in a God was rational -- nobody had constructed
these arguments, there was no scholarly analysis of the Bible, nobody had
done the research into Biblical history, etc.
It's entirely possible that theists more than 200 years ago where quite
rational -- and if you have any that fit this bill, Marie, I think we
should consider them for the position of saints.
Much after that date, though, and I become very dubious of their
rationality -- to much evidence existed.
I nominate Thomas Jefferson as a virion saint.
The Jeffersonian Perspective:
http://www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/7970/index.htm
(his work on the Jefferson Bible alone qualifies him in my mind!)
> Exactly. That's why the most *rational* stance is not atheism,
> but agnosticism.
Again, I have to disagree. Agnosticism is the position that WE CANNOT KNOW
the truth about God. I find it quite rash to think we will be forever in
the dark -- indeed, such a position HAS TO rely on the "dark corners" of
the universe idea. (Just think about what it means: it means God is HIDING
from us -- why would It do that, It he exists?)
Weak atheism, on the other hand, is simply a lack of belief in a God. NOT
the positive assertion that God does not exist! (that is called STRONG
atheism)
However, if you will DEFINE your God, most weak atheists will be able to
tell you whether THAT PARTICULAR God could exist or not) A weak atheist
does not rule out God's existence -- just admits that no God in any current
religion (aside from pantheism, of course) exists, because logical
arguments can be constructed which show their non-existence.
Sorry about the lecture, but ignorance is my enemy, and I choose to fight
it!
ERiC