virus: pale religious lechery

carlw (
Tue, 9 Mar 1999 05:45:05 -0600

I'll drink to that, Joe!
Not only is their alleged "goodwill" restricted to members of their own camps, not just "Christian’ but sect, but they are able to dispense with any form of good will any time they perceive their sect to be under fire - and most so called "Christians" will justify any horrendous action taken against others as being sanctified by their god. Give me a pagan who tries to live his life by reason and the golden rule over any number of faith-based people able to convince themselves (and justify) that whatever they desire at that very moment is "sanctified" by their faith.
As for the claims of good will, I have never met anyone competent at differentiating "us and them" that was not a "believer" in one form of thing or another. And while the mystics can be stupid, it is the religionists who are the worst. My experience indicates that people who live lives based on faith were exactly the inspiration for Israel Zangwillni when he said, "The Jews are a frightened people. Nineteen centuries of Christian love has broken down their nerves."
TheHermit (shuddering)
And a few atheist quotes. Funny, how they all seem to be reacting against these gentle people of faith, particularly the Christians. What has been, and still is, wrong with the non-Christians, that prevents them from seeing all this goodwill of which you speak?
But before I get going, let me add one... "I never knew an atheist, who trusted in the goodwill of a ‘Christian’" - TheHermit
A random pot pourrie on the violence of Christians follows, followed by a few on reason.
Try and for a rather accurate historical perspective of religion.
Use against heretics the spiritual sword of excommunication, and if this does not prove effective, use the material sword. Pope Innocent III 1161-1216
When the Albigenses Christians in southern France wouldn't conform to official dogma,
Pope Innocent III (more about thios at hte URL's quoted above, sent troops to exterminate them. After the town of Beziers was captured, soldiers asked their papal adviser how to distinguish the faithful from the heretics among the townspeople. The command: "Kill them all. God will know his own." It was done. About 40,000 were killed.
Of course, the christian is merely obeying his master. Luke 19:27 "But those mine enemies, which would not that I should reign over then, bring hither and slay them before me" Alleged words of "Christ" (KJV). And of course this simply followed the examples of the historical inventors of genocide, the Jews. Psalm 137:9 "Happy shall he be, that taketh and dasheth thy little ones against the stones" Alleged words of "God" (KJV) On the dogmas of religion, as distinguished from moral principles, all mankind, from the
beginning of the world to this day, have been quarreling, fighting, burning and torturing one
another for abstractions unintelligible to themselves and to all others, and absolutely beyond
the comprehension of the human mind. Thomas Jefferson The missionaries go forth to Christianize the savages as if the savages weren't dangerous enough already. Edward Abbey There is one notable thing about our Christianity: bad, bloody, merciless, money-grabbing
and predatory as it is - in our country particularly, and in all other Christian countries in a
somewhat modified degree - it is still a hundred times better than the Christianity of the
Bible, with its prodigious crime- the invention of Hell. Measured by our Christianity of today,
bad as it is, hypocritical as it is, empty and hollow as it is, neither the Deity nor His Son is a Christian, nor qualified for that moderately high place. Ours is a terrible religion. The fleets of the world could swim in spacious comfort in the innocent blood it has spilt. Mark Twain in Reflections on Religion
Fear prophets ... and those prepared to die for the truth, as a rule make many others
die with them, often before them, and at times instead of them. [Umberto Eco]
Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction.
[Blaise Pascal]
"The infliction of cruelty with a good conscience is a delight to moralists - that is why they invented hell." --Bertrand Russell (1872-1970) No wild beasts are as hostile to men as Christian sects in general are to one another. [Emperor Julian]
Religion is the last refuge of human savagery. [Alfred North Whitehead] Why do born-again people so often make you wish they'd never been born the first time? [Katherine Whitehorn]
When I think of all the harm the Bible has done, I despair of ever writing anything to equal it. [Oscar Wilde]
The main doctrine of a fanatic's creed is that his enemies are the enemies of God. [Andrew White]
I do not believe I have any immortality. The greatest evil in the world today is the Christian religion. [H.G. Wells] "What is it the Bible teaches us? - rapine, cruelty, and murder. What is it the Testament teaches us? - to believe that the Almighty committed debauchery with a woman engaged to be married, and the belief of this debauchery is called faith." Thomas Paine, The Age of Reason "I distrust those people who know so well what God wants them to do because I notice it always coincides with their own desires. Susan B. Anthony "If God were suddenly condemned to live the life which He has inflicted upon men, He would kill Himself." Alexandre Dumas, fils "God says do what you wish, but make the wrong choice and you will be tortured for eternity in hell. That sir, is not free will. It would be akin to a man telling his girlfriend, do what you wish, but if you choose to leave me, I will track you down and blow your brains out. When a man says this we call him a psychopath and cry out for his imprisonment/execution. When god says the same we call him "loving" and build churches in his honor." --William C. Easttom II
"Kill one man and you are a murderer. Kill millions and you are a conqueror. Kill all and you are a God." Jean Rostand "Men rarely (if ever) manage to dream up a god superior to themselves. Most gods have the manners and morals of a spoiled child." RA Heinlein "I'm completely in favor of the separation of Church and State. My idea is that these two institutions screw us up enough on their own, so both of them together is certain death." George Carlin "We preach peace, forgiveness, tolerance and love. We practice vengeance, persecution, hatred and domination. My personal beliefs are supported and validated by my convictions. Oh, and never forget .... my religion is truth, yours is a lie." George Carlin
"There once was a time when all people believed in God and the church ruled. This time was called the Dark Ages." Richard Lederer, "The infliction of cruelty with a good conscience is a delight to moralists - that is why they invented hell." Bertrand Russell (1872-1970) Christianity must be divine, since it has lasted 1,700 years despite the fact that it is so full of villany and nonsense. Voltaire Better sleep with a sober cannibal than a drunken Christian. Herman Melville in Moby Dick
Any frontal attack on ignorance is bound to fail because the masses are always ready to defend their most precious possession-- their ignorance. Hendrik Willem van Loon
I could keep quoting ad-nauseam. Before getting going on reason, in my opinion this has not been surpassed:
Reason is not one tool of thought among many, it is the entire toolbox. To advocate that reason be discarded in some circumstances is to advocate that thinking be discarded- which leaves one in the position of attempting to do a job after throwing away the required instrument. George Smith If you don't think that logic is a good method for determining what to believe, make an attempt to convince me of that without using logic. Brett Lemoine
If the lord had meant us to have faith, he'd have given us lobotomies. Zlatko
So, when Adam and Eve were in the Garden of Eden, if you go for all these fairy tales, that evil woman convinced the man to eat the apple, but the apple came from the Tree of Knowledge. And the punishment that was then handed down, the woman gets to bleed and the guy's got to go to work, is the result of a man desiring, because his woman suggested that it would be a good idea, that he get all the knowledge that was supposedly the property and domain of God. So, that right away sets up Christianity as an antiintellectual religion. You never want to be that smart. If you're a woman, it's going to be running down your leg, and if you're a guy, you're going to be in the salt mines for the rest of your life. So, just be a dumb fuck and you'll all go to heaven. That's the subtext of Christianity. [Frank Zappa] It is a farce to call any being virtuous whose virtues do not result from the exercise of it's own reason. [Mary Wollstonecraft] We cannot hope for a society in which formal organized religion dies out. But we can stop behaving as if it was worthy of our collective respect. [A. N. Wilson, Against Religion]
My earlier views at the unsoundness of the Christian scheme of salvation and the human origin of the scriptures, have become clearer and stronger with advancing years and I see no reason for thinking I shall ever change them. Abraham Lincoln in a letter to Judge J.S. Wakefield, after the death of Willie Lincoln
"Your sweet little book is a bizarre collection of out-of-context quotations, misquotations, misleading quotations, non sequiturs, errors of fact and just about every other dirty intellectual trick known to man." Tim O'Neill, on the JW's anti-evolution book "It ain't those parts of the Bible that I can't understand that bother me, it's the parts that I do understand." Mark Twain (1835-1910) "Faith may be defined briefly as an illogical belief in the occurrence of the improbable." --H.L. Mencken (1880-1956) "A casual stroll through the lunatic asylum shows that faith does not prove anything." --Friedrich Wilhelm Nietzsche (1844-1900) "God does not play dice with the universe; He plays an ineffable game of his own devising, which might be compared, from the perspective of any of the other players, to being involved in an obscure and complex version of poker in a pitch dark room, with blank cards, for infinite stakes, with a dealer who won't tell you the rules, and who smiles all the time." --Gaiman and Pratchett
The inhabitants of the earth are of two sorts: those with brains, but no religion, and those with religion, but no brains. Abul'-Ala' al-Ma'arri (973-1057) The blind Syrian poet.
Faith is a cop-out. It is intellectual bankruptcy. If the only way you can accept an assertion
is by faith, then you are conceding that it can't be taken on its own merits. Dan Barker former evangelist, author. Even some Christians have doubts...
When the missionaries came to Africa they had the Bible and we had the land. They said, "Let us pray." We closed out eyes. When we opened them we had the Bible and they had the land. Arch Bishop Desmond Tutu
> -----Original Message-----
> From:
> []On Behalf
> Of joe dees
> Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 1999 4:00 AM
> To:
> Subject: Re: Re:RE: virus: pale religious lechery
> Once their pastor has identified an infidel, adversary or
> enemy for them, their us/them nature roils to the fore, and
> they become eminently directable and casually,
> un-self-consciouslessly and willingly vicious animals.
> Having been a NOW escort at abortion clinics in the front
> lines of Pensacola, Florida, and with a couple of dead
> friends who had their faces shotgunned off one bright morning
> by a familiar face from the other side of the line (Paul
> Hill), I can with full confidence say that you know not
> whereof you speak, and beyond that, in the sacred memory of
> my martyered allies, UP YOUIR ASS WITH A CHUNK OF DIRTY GLASS!!!!!
> At Tue, 9 Mar 1999 00:53:01 -0800, you wrote:
> >
> >Joe wrote:
> >
> >>This is true in Christian principle; however, more often than not,
> >>christians in practice restrict their Goodwill to those whom they
> >>know or assume to share their faith.
> >
> >This is complete bollocks, I've had my ass pulled out of
> many a very, very
> >sticky situation by Christians practicing universal
> Goodwill. And even the
> >simplest among them could not possibly assume, from looking
> at me, that I
> >would ever even begin to share their faith!
> >
> >You're talking out your ass again, Joe. If there is one
> thing I can say
> >generally about most Christians, they are creatures of habit. And
> >practicing Goodwill is instilled in them habitually.
> >
> >-Prof. Tim
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> Joe E. Dees
> Poet, Pagan, Philosopher
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