re: Re: virus: Re:[genius] Sexism

Bryan Wheelock (
Wed, 24 Feb 1999 09:55:45 -0600

At 03:52 AM 2/24/99 -0600, you wrote:
>Bryan W. wrote:
>>I think that the Feminism movement has some of the more powerful memes that
>>I have seen. I don't know if I can even think of a woman that wouldn't
>>consider herself a feminist.
>I don't consider myself a Feminist, and yet I do. I'll try to explain. I
>do not identify entirely with the whole Feminist organization, or include
>myself in a group whose every principle I don't agree with. I believe in a
>different kind of Feminism though, and I have my own radical ideas about
>it. To put it very briefly, (oh you know how I do go on...) I don't want
>to be a proponent of this mystical 'femininity'(tm) that I keep hearing
>about. It's not about being pro-female or anti-men for me. That's a common
>myth about feminists that I cannot stand- that we all hate men. (Just
>because misogynists do it, doesn't mean we would stoop that low.) It's
>about asserting yourself as a human being.
>I'm not really clear on my own convictions about feminism, but for me it's
>more of a personal attitude rather than a form of social action. I don't
>want to remain inert, and I agree that we need to speak out about the
>issues that concern us, but I don't think it's necessary for all women to
>'team up' either. Am I making any sense?
>Basically, I don't associate with the feminist movement and their group
>because I think it's enough to be myself, and NOT be a certain kind of
>woman (submissive, passive, sexist, stereotypical) to stop oppression.
>Yes, people need to work together to accomplish things, but for me, being
>outspoken about my opinions, relating to males on the same level, being
>educated and intelligent, challenging myself and others, and striving to be
>the best person I can be, and not allowing myself to be held back by
>sexism, is in fact being a feminist.

This is an excellent point. I have seen many people in our society, including myself on occassion, taking the victim role. Your attitude and philosophy allows you to move beyond that to become a intelligent free thinking woman. Great:-)
As I understand it, part of the MO for this list is to create people that can think just like you. As a question to the list, am I correct here?

>>This meme has began maybe 50 years ago and has reached at least 25% of the
>>population. How did this spread so quickly?
>>My guess is that these memes are passed on to women at a point when they
>>are very confused about their personal identity. This created the
>>opportunity for the idea to slip inside.
>I would think that it's passed on at a time when they are searching for a
>solution to a crisis. In my view, it's the woman that finds Feminism, and
>not the other way around.
>>So the freshman girl at the Big School decides to try on the idea. The
>>statistics make a lot of sense.(This makes it seem scientific.)There are
>>the numbers right there on the paper. (Click)
>>There are also a lot of anecdotes about some of the bad things men have
>>done against women.
>>This same girl most likely is surrounded by people during the incubation
>>phase that all hold the same beliefs.(Peer pressure)
>Whoa....not at all. In my experience, girls in grade and high school are
>not at ALL feminists. Perhaps some here and there, but the majority are
>more like the opposite at that age. It's not until they are older and join
>the 'real world' that they become more 'aware'. I've found that it's not
>until college that students are encouraged to think for themselves; unless
>the parents do it, the situation is quite the opposite. In high school the
>prevalent message is: Do not think for yourself. Let authority and pop
>culture determine your perception. Conform.
>I agree that being surrounded by like-minded individuals does validate and
>influence your thinking/perception. However, I don't think it's statistics
>and facts, but life-long experience that convinces a woman of the need for
>change. It happens to me when I think about my past, and analyze my

I agree, my experience has been that most people will only agree with something if they can work it into their model of the world.
>If only people listened to "treat others as you would be treated.."
>*wishful thinking*

>I think that's about awareness. Awareness is one of the most important
>things to achieve, because women's rights have been ignored and abused for
>so long. The current crisis needs to be acknowledged, first of all. If
>ignorance and hatred are the cause of the problem to begin with,
>information, recognition, and enlightenment are the first step to solving it.
Tomaeto, Tomatoe
Potaeto, Potatoe

This is how the meme is spread.
>>Kristy, I would love to hear exactly how you began to learn about this?
>>What exactly was it that made it feel true? How do you know that it is not
>Wow, that is a loaded question. I'm not sure if it was ever a process of
>learning or being taught. I never had a class (unless you count Life 101
>;-)) to inform me. There are Women's Studies at universities of course,
>but I'm not familiar with those. Actually, I plead ignorance; I've never
>formally studied 'Feminism'.

Of course not, how were you first exposed to the idea? Was it a pamphlet or a paper?
Perhaps someone just told you some interesting facts.

This is what I was looking for.

>I don't think you need an instructor on civil rights to tell you something
>is wrong; you just know it in your heart. (As cheesy as that sounds.) I
>may have interpreted your questions incorrectly, but are you asking how I
>know Feminism is not wrong? Well, I know first and foremost that I am a
>human being that deserves to be treated a certain way, and NOT a certain
>way. With the same respect and consideration that you deserve. How can
>that be wrong?
>>I think that Feminism can teach us a great deal?
>I don't know about teaching us..but inspiring us, perhaps?
>Thanks for the reply.
Thank you for sharing,