RE: virus: Levels

Sodom (
Mon, 26 Apr 1999 17:10:14 -0400

Actually - that is my opinion also, minus the equine feces. Basically it looks like a goal driven idea - the goal is to satisfy your brain candy addiction. The results you are after are self satisfaction. So far, I have yet to see a definite benefit of this type of thinking yet - and I have yet to see a description of "level 3" that serves a purpose other than self pleasuring.

I am NOT saying that there is anything wrong with this motive. I see no problem with people who knowingly modify their way of thinking to avoid dealing with conflicting evidence OR to enjoy dealing with conflicting evidence.

What I have a difficult time understanding are the real world benefits. I think some would argue that it gives insight into perspectives that are opposed to your own. But that is easily achievable without making permanent changes to the way you think. An example would be in reading the bible. When reading the Gospels, I was amazed and in love with the writing. I had no trouble putting my knowledge of science and history on hold for this purpose. My immersion seemed flawless and while in the throws of reading, I could have stood up there with the best of em and started preaching believably. I spent days speaking with Xtians about the glory of Christ and God. I still knew how flawed by history and physics the writing was, but emotionally it was irrelevant. After a few weeks, and a decent confidence that I understood the emotional aspects of this particular belief - I somewhat easily shook off the yoke of Christ and filed the experience away.

Benefits: I did indeed get a peek at the way some Xtians think Drawbacks: It took a great deal of time and effort to assimilate enough information to make the transition (for me anyway). After the experience, the way in which I deal with Xtians is worse - as now I know the spell can be broken and they are clinging because the have a NEED to believe or have been force fed. I went from seeing Xtians as people who believe because they see the sense, and the truth of it - to seeing Xtians as victims, like herd animals, sheep, that need to be herded, sheared and eaten.

Now, I could be wrong, but I suspect that what I did would be easy for anyone to do. For this time I held multiple belief systems that are opposed to one another. Both concepts were very powerful in my mind, and sometimes difficult to live with as different decisions had to be made constantly based upon the "knowledge" of the bible and "knowledge" of reality. Admittedly I was tainted in the end - throughout the entire process, part of me suspected that I would drop the mysticism aspects that I developed in favor of neuro-chemistry - But I was not sure all the time - sometimes I started leaning toward Christ out of the simple desire for it to be that way. Fortunately it passed.

This last note: I am not opposed, nor do I think the level system is crap. I simply think that this system cannot do justice to the multitude of ways in which people think and act. It may well be that people generally fall into these categories, but to assume that they must fall into one of these categories seems in itself a limited mindset that cannot be very accurate - though marginally useful.

Bill Roh
-----Original Message-----
From: [] On Behalf Of Bob Hartwig

Sent:	Tuesday, February 16, 1999 3:38 PM
Subject:	Re: virus: Levels

>That is the core of Level 3. If a theory or argument doesn't
>agree with you and your purpose, then you don't have to obey

So those of us who think the "Levels" are horse shit are on Level 3?